Prohibitionists Say The Darndest Things

Over the weekend the Christian Science Monitor newspaper published the latest installment of their ‘one minute debates’ series. The subject of the debate: “Should California Legalize Pot?” I authored the ‘pro’ argument, which you can read here, and longtime, professional prohibitionist Calvina Fay penned the ‘con’ side.

Now anyone who is familiar with Calvina already knows of her propensity toward lunacy — Here’s just one example, “Truly sick people who deserve legitimate medical treatment have been duped into believing that marijuana will help them, while in reality it is hurting them.” — but this time, in her vitriol against California’s Prop. 19, she really outdoes herself, arguing that regulating the adult use of cannabis is a threat to… marriage!

Should California legalize pot?
via The Christian Science Monitor

No: legalization means more costs

… Legalizing marijuana use would substantially increase its already formidable costs to society. That’s because the initiative would allow individuals to possess up to about 120 joints and cultivate 25 square feet of plants, capable of yielding up to 240,000 joints.

… Legalization would also create an influx in drugged-driving fatalities, more deteriorated neighborhoods, more divorce, more domestic violence, more child abuse, and more addiction!

Whoa — 120 joints per ounce?! As NORML Outeach Director Russ Belville writes, that’s some fuzzy math. (A more realistic conversion might be 30, or at most 60, joints.) However, such hyperbole is par for the course for our opposition. They are well aware that they can not win this debate on merit, and as a result they now have only the most foolish fear-mongering to fall back on. Fortunately, the polls show that this tactic is also doomed to fail.

(FYI, for those wishing to weigh in on the CSM debate, you can post your comments on Yahoo News here.)

And speaking of fear-mongering, I have an op/ed in today’s online version of The Hill rebutting claims of various Prop. 19 detractors, including California Senator Diane Feinstein and Drug Czar Gil Kerlikowske. Here is an excerpt:

Proposition 19 is the right direction
via The Hill.com

So then why are Sen. Feinstein and the drug czars so worried about adults consuming it in the privacy of their own home?

California lawmakers criminalized the possession and use of marijuana in 1913 — a full 24 years before the federal government enacted prohibition. Yet right now in California, the state Board of Equalization reports that some 400,000 use marijuana daily. Self-evidently, cannabis is here to stay.

It’s time to reject the drug czar’s tired rhetoric, and abandon the failed federal policy of criminal marijuana prohibition. Let’s stop ceding control of this market to unregulated, untaxed criminal enterprises and put it in the hands of licensed businesses. Let’s stop sanctioning adults for private behavior that is engaged in absent of harm to others. …Proposition 19 is a first step in this direction.

Read NORML’s full commentary here.

The Hill’s ever-popular Congress blog ‘is where lawmakers come to blog.’ It’s also where legislators and other politicos — such as staffers at the Drug Czar’s office (hint, hint) — come to gauge the pulse of the public. Given that this is a paper of record in these folks’ backyard, why not send a message to those in Washington that their opposition is out of touch with voter sentiment. You can make your voice heard by leaving your feedback here.

49 thoughts

  1. If Christian “scientist” listened to their holy doctrine they might have a very different opinion.

    Douay-Rheims Bible Mathew 7:17
    A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can an evil tree bring forth good fruit.

    Genesis 1:29.
    “And God said, Behold, I have given you every herb bearing seed, which is upon the face of all the earth, and every tree, in which is the fruit of a tree yielding seed; to you it shall be for meat.”

    Matthew 7:4 “Or how can you say to your brother, ‘Let me take the speck out of your eye,’ and behold, the log is in your own eye?

    Ideological point, since Christianity speaks no ill of Marijuana, and is “divine doctrine” is it not safe to say since it never mentions it that since they prophesies the future if it was a problem it would have spoken of it.

    Kill the Temperance Movement!

  2. Please vote for Proposition 19 and have the truth come out. United States had enough of this cruel and costly prohibition. Let California be the first among the the fifty states to show the world the truth.

  3. “Truly sick people who deserve legitimate medical treatment have been duped into believing that marijuana will help them, while in reality it is hurting them.”

    That makes me so angry.

  4. I would think this uninformative nonsense posted by Calvina would help Proposition 19. She is not giving any factual information, and I think the voters of CA are saavy enough to see through it. Let her keep talking, from my perspective she is helping.

  5. All and all it’s just another brick in the wall. Obama won’t debate it because there is no argument. And you are 100 percent correct! It is here to stay and its not going away so officials better get used to it.

  6. how crazy are these people they spread thier lies on what they personally believe not on the facts,facts are pot has been illegal for at least 30 years and we dont have the problems she is worried about quit telling your lies pot smoking didnt just start today i have smoked since 1976
    u cant blame the problems of society on pot smoking that god put here to use. my veiws are morerealistic truths than hers the real crime is punishing people for using it please get it legalized

  7. #4 – “Truly sick people who deserve legitimate medical treatment have been duped into believing that marijuana will help them, while in reality it is hurting them.”

    I would like to see her evidence and will show her all mine. Can we line this up?

  8. why the heck do they think I smoke pinners? hay man let make four joints out of this gram .25 is a bowl at most. they dont get it the people that smoke allot like me can get ganja fine and if anything it will weed out the kids that just do it because they think that it is a cool thing tah do yeah know that crowd bullshit!

  9. So let’s see how many holes can be poked in this statement alone:

    … Legalization would also create an influx in drugged-driving fatalities (WRONG! Show me one stoned individual that would actually decide to leave the comfort of their own home, much less get into a car and actually drive somewhere!)
    … more deteriorated neighborhoods (WRONG!! Less gangs, less graffitti and gang tags, more social interaction in the community)
    … more divorce (WRONG! If nothing else, I would argue that cannabis could help to salvage marriages on the rocks!)
    . . .more domestic violence, more child abuse (WRONG! Violence and Cannabis have NEVER EVER been linked!! Yet alcohol, on the other hand. . .)
    …and more addiction! (WRONG!! It’s not even addictive!)

    I would argue that by keeping cannabis and other drugs illegal, the following statement applies:
    POLITICIANS THAT SUPPORT PROHIBITION ARE PUTTING CHILDREN IN HARMS WAY!!

    (That should get some people’s attention)

    hey, if all drugs were legal I’m pretty sure that Crystal Meth wouldn’t be the scourge that it is today. . .just sayin’)

    End Prohibition. . .LEGALIZE FREEDOM!

  10. Anyone who believes any of the BS prohibs spew is no free thinking, freedom loving American. Research it and find out for yourselves. Those in control lie to get where their at and then lie to stay in control or place people in the positions to lie for them. Bait and switch? No, it’s switch then bait. I have a feeling that if they didn’t lie then Americans would be very upset with those who say they’re trying to help when in truth they’re the ones that are destroying this country. All so they can collect on the souls of a nation. Disgusting.

  11. Lying liars and the lies they tell. Prohibition 2.0 began with Harry Anslinger lying about “reefer madness” and the violence that cannabis spawns. To pass the Prohibition 2.0 legislation he had to lie to Congress that medical doctors were supportive of the ban on cannabis, instead referring to it as “Mexican loco weed” or “marihuana”.

    But Anslinger’s propaganda about the evils of cannabis took a directly opposing POV in the 1950’s, when he reported that cannabis would erode the “fighting will” of our armed forces, turning them into pacifists.

    The CIA and other intelligence organs of the USA explored the use of cannabis and other psychotropic drugs as “truth serums”, as well as agents for “brainwashing” in the 1950’s and 1960’s, all without meaningful positive results — laughter or quiet meditation was the result.

    This country has had a commercial and medical interest in cannabis since the first settlers at Jamestown Colony, as each settler was responsible for growing enough hemp for trade with Britain, as clothing, sailcloth, and rope. Both George Washington and Thomas Jefferson included both cannabis and opium among their crops, besides tobacco. And the all-inclusive ban on cannabis was lifted during World War 2, in order to meet the wartime need for hemp rope and hemp canvas.

    Two government funded scientific investigations into the positive and negative aspects of decriminalizing or re-legalizing of cannabis both recommended a liberalization of the prohibition against cannabis, finding that the greatest harm came from prohibition itself. That would be the La Guardia Commission and Nixon’s Shafer Commission, and both reports were buried for indeterminate political reasons.

    Cannabis has been used by man for food, medicine, rope, and clothing since the beginning of recorded history. It is one of the safest medicines, herbal or otherwise, known to man. If it were discovered and investigated yesterday, it would have been touted as the most medically beneficial plant ever known. The USA’s Prohibition 2.0 severely limits our investigation of its’ many healing properties compared to other countries.

    Why is this harmless plant still prohibited,and its’ users persecuted?

  12. Are there any job requirements for the dictator position of drug czar? It seems they’ll let anyone who is willing to lie for a living take the job. They let W Benit make arbitrary decisions about the war on some drugs when he flushed millions of dollars down the toilet playing video poker. Is he the only one to participate in that absurd self-destruction, likely not, but he used to make a so-called living by pushing and “enforcing” fake morals on free individuals as if he tells people what their best interests are. It’s not an ad hominem to call a hypocrite a hypocrite. The world will be a better place when the DEA is disbanded because it creates the problems it claims to solve.

  13. Calvina Fay gets her pay from the Drug Free America Foundation, Inc. which used to be called Straight, Inc, a spin-off of 12 step groups, which are clearly religious in nature. So she actually works for the drug “treatment” industry which is a profit making enterprise that has been shown to be no more effective than making a personal decision to just quit using whatever substance is causing very serious problems in the person’s life. Problems from pot come from the unreasonable illegality of it. It’s obvious she has never even tried pot because if she did she would laugh and then feel shame at how driven by anger and ignorance all these years. That is unless she is susceptible to mental illness which might not be impossible considering what’s written about her on the internet. In that case she should take her own advice and abstain from pot but then stfu about telling others what to do. Crazy micro managers who are out to fix all things not broke, will ruin everything if you let them. They need to fill a gap that is missing from their lives and fill it by telling others what to do.

  14. As a “truly sick” person who did deserve and get “legitimate medical treatment” (a cancer patient who was cured by a long series of chemotherapy treatments), I have to say that statement angers me too. I can honestly say, and my doctor would agree with me 100%, that I would have starved to death on chemo if it wasn’t for medical marijuana. None of the other drugs the doctor gave me to control the nausea and loss of appetite even came close to working, I just couldn’t eat, but when I decided to try smoking a bowl about half an hour before a meal I was able to eat with no problems. In fact my doctor said I was actually the only one of his patients to ever gain weight on chemo.

  15. I think what Calvina was attempting to do was “preach to the choir” hoping the Christians reading would relate. What she obvious doesn’t understand is that the Christian Science Monitor is actually more balanced than most main stream media. I’m not a Christian and I read it regularly.

  16. 120 joints/oz isn’t really that unrealistic. I smoke about 1/3 of a gram (headies) in each joint, which comes out to almost 120 joints in 28 grams.

    You guys are just old so you a) smoke a lot more because you have tolerances/really love it (or you wouldn’t work at NORML), and b) smoke shitty weed.

    Sorry. Just sayin’.

    [Editor’s note: You should go by the apt handle ‘pinnahead’ (for your teeny tiny joints and small mindedness. Just sayin’…]

  17. $113 billion is spent on marijuana every year in the U.S., and because of the federal prohibition *every* dollar of it goes straight into the hands of criminals. Far from preventing people from using marijuana, the prohibition instead creates zero legal supply amid massive and unrelenting demand.

    According to the ONDCP, at least sixty percent of Mexican drug cartel money comes from selling marijuana in the U.S., they protect this revenue by brutally torturing, murdering and dismembering countless innocent people.

    If we can STOP people using marijuana then we need to do so NOW, but if we can’t then we need to legalize the production and sale of marijuana to adults with after-tax prices set too low for the cartels to match. One way or the other, we have to force the cartels out of the marijuana market and eliminate their highly lucrative marijuana incomes – no business can withstand the loss of sixty percent of its revenue!

    To date, the cartels have amassed more than 100,000 “foot soldiers” and operate in 230 U.S. cities, and the longer they’re allowed to exploit the prohibition the more powerful they’ll get and the more our own personal security will be put in jeopardy.

  18. … “Legalization would also create an influx in drugged-driving fatalities, more deteriorated neighborhoods, more divorce, more domestic violence, more child abuse, and more addiction!”

    I have never known a violent, abusive or addicted pot smoker. More “Reefer Madness” propaganda.

  19. so, business as usual then, keep the jails full, the border overflowing, and tax revenue going to other countries, I never want things to change!

  20. At best, Calvina Fay is a fascinating reincarnation of Carrie A. Nation, Chicken Little and Harry J. Anslinger. Unfortunately for every freedom loving American, she is also the very definition of the most dangerous creature to ever exist on this planet. She is someone who honestly believes she knows what is better for everyone else than they do, and has the power to do something about that inclination. Calvina Fay should rightfully be arrested and tried for her “drug war” crimes against humanity, violations of God’s will for people to live in freedom with liberty as acknowledged and cited in the Constitution of the United States. She should be sentenced to prison and forced to re-read the Constitution. She should only be released after she learns to mind her own business.

  21. Whoa — 120 joints per ounce?! As NORML Outeach Director Russ Belville writes, that’s some fuzzy math.

    The math actually came from CA CORML Coordinator, Dale Gieringer, Ph.D. in his paper the Economics of Cannabis Legalization-reprinted by Ed Rosenthal in Hemp Today. According to Dr. Gieringer, an ounce of marijuana can make 60-120 joints.

  22. I have Fibromyalgia, and smoking gets me through the day. Marijuana is not legal for medicinal use where I live, more’s the pity. I work 40+ hrs a week as a cook. Everyday all over pain, at times disabling, would put me on SSD where it not for the pain relief from smoking. Can’t tell you how relieving it is to get up everyday and go to work, knowing I can get through it. I can live my life…I can’t fathom why I should be punished for that!

  23. This fascination with the number of joints per ounce is amusing. An ounce is an ounce no matter how much you divide it. Prohibitionists like Ms Fay seem to think a 120-joint ounce is more “dangerous” than a 30 or 60-joint ounce.

    By the way, congratulations if you can roll 120 joints from an ounce, but your lungs might be in more danger from the extra paper you’ll be smoking than from the pot.

  24. You guys need to stop all your yick yacking chit chatting about prohibition, health, materials, history, dea this and that, wasted tax money, and whatever else on how marijuana is so good for this economy

    Im in iraq and this is the last tour “NEW DAWN” if you want to make your soilders proud get on promoting people to vote in california we already did on obama website got his attention now its time to get the real law enacted. Trust me california is the trend setter so other states will follow NH, Michigan, and others are just behind.
    Do it for your country!

  25. “The math actually came from CA CORML Coordinator, Dale Gieringer, Ph.D. in his paper the Economics of Cannabis Legalization-reprinted by Ed Rosenthal in Hemp Today. According to Dr. Gieringer, an ounce of marijuana can make 60-120 joints.”

    Toothpick spliffs…

  26. Toothpick spliffs.

    LOL, but how true. I used to know someone, back in the day, that could squeeze about 120 joints out of an OZ. They were too freaking small to pass around, and so tight it could give somebody a hernia trying to draw a hit. Made really great incense though.
    Fatties OTOH are a social treat — puff and pass, puff and pass.

    Free the weed, and free your minds. That’s what the man fears most. Peace, brothers and sisters.

  27. Register and vote by mail YES on Prop 19 to regulate, tax, and control cannabis in California in 2010 so that we may bring honesty, truth and the application of science to the overall issue of marijuana in our society. Prop 19 is the first major step in knocking down the Berlin Wall which gives prohibitionists their power, allowing them to make wild, baseless, fear driving statements which bear no resemblance to the truth. When I hear some of the outlandish statements prohibitionists say with obviously no experience behind them to back up their words, I often end up laughing out loud at what Americans may not understand now to be nonsense, but they will one day. YES on Prop 19 is a step towards understanding and balance. Toast a green hit to 2010, the year of understanding and compassion.

    Ty Palmer :: Founder

  28. “Legalization would also create an influx in drugged-driving fatalities, more deteriorated neighborhoods, more divorce, more domestic violence, more child abuse, and more addiction!”

    More divorce? More child abuse? Well, why stop there. If you’re going to spin “facts” out of whole cloth, why not claim legalization also will result in more hurricanes and, while you’re at it, more extraterrestrial alien invasions?

    Frankly, bring it. The more inane, the better.

  29. Good one, Bob. Hell, throw in Global Warming, starving Africans, rising oil prices, War in [insert Middle Eastern country here], and sun spots too!

  30. 1. Sam Baldwin

    Then too Jesus Christ was baptized with Kanah Bosm.
    What’s good for jesus Christ – is good for the U.S.A.

  31. Hey, NORML, in keeping with the idea from one of the Vets above, how about setting up a “click here for voter registration info for your state” button?

    Turning out the vote in November means that we need to get people registered today!

    I’m a Christian who takes seriously Jesus’s command to do unto others what I would have them do unto me. I know that if my child were using marijuana, I’d want to work with him or her as a parent rather than seeing him or her with a criminal record, in jail with the sexual predators, lose their college financial aid, and all of the very real harm that would be caused, not by the marijuana, but by the law. I’d hate for that to happen to anyone’s child, but it does, every day. Every single day. It’s the law.

    Likewise, if my aging parents were to try a little marijuana to ease the aches and pains of growing older, I would not want to see the police confiscate their home and sell it under the property forfeiture laws. I’d hate for that to happen to anyone’s parent, but it does. Every day. Every single day.

    I encourage people to: Regiser. Vote. Change things. Share the links.

    All the anti-prop-19 arguments boil down to “it’s better to put people in jail than to let ordinary Americans grow a little marijuana in their own back yards.”

    The key to success: Register to vote. You’ve got to register well in advance of election day; it only takes five minutes (even if you have to download a form and take it downtown, it’s well worth the effort). All of these links use the usual h t t p : / / w w w prefix:

    California:
    sos.ca.gov/elections/elections_vr.htm or to vote by mail
    sos.ca.gov/elections/elections_m.htm

    Vermont
    vermont-elections.org/elections1/registertovote.html

    South Dakota:
    sdsos.gov/electionsvoteregistration/registrationvoting.shtm

    Arizona:
    Voter info:
    azsos.gov/election/VoterInformation.htm
    Register: azsos.gov/election/voterregistration.htm

    Michigan: michigan.gov/documents/MIVoterRegistration_97046_7.pdf

    Oregon: oregonvotes.org/votreg/vreg.htm

    Others: Google your state name and “voter registration.”
    College students: You can usually register as a citizen of either your hometown or your college residence town. Share the voter registration info through your student newspaper, twitter, etc.

    Everybody: Most states allow early voting and/or vote-by-mail, so once you’re registered, go ahead and request a ballot (at the voter info site for your state). Save a trip to the polls and get it done while you’re thinking about it.

    5 minutes. Change the world. Share the links.

  32. These people are NOT christians . They have taken a back seat with Satan himself . Truth is , Catholics , Methodists , 7th day aventists and all the rest of these churches are really the anti – Christ with all they lies & follow Satan with their many methods of deceit & deception. These ARE NOT CHURCHES , THEY ARE BUSINESS ORGANIZATIONS .They lust for money & power over the
    Earth .Christ himself warned us of FALSE CHRISTIANS in these days .

  33. Calvina Fay is a prime example of the ANTI – CHRIST . Her stating that she represents a ” Drug Free America ” already makes her a hypocrite and liar .

    SATAN IS A MASTER OF DECEPTION & she has sided with the great master of Satan , the DEVIL HIMSELF .

  34. It is with the greatest pleasure that I inform each and every pot-phobic prohib hypocrite, especially Calvina Fay, that while they are up on their soap box, spewing their “God awful shit,” all over he place, their bodies are producing endogenous cannabinoids – anandamides, all by their self. That’s right! Their bodies are little “pot factories” – and -there’s absolutely nothing they can do about it – because – God has made it so. I’m laughing so hard I’m about to pee my pants. The fact of the matter is – God made us with a cannabinoid system, cannabinoid receptors, and cannabis itself. So! who can argue with God? Right! Calvina Fay – that’s who. Enough said! The truth be with God! Amen.

  35. Hi new to blog.norml.org and loving it so far! I’m a CMO(Chief Marketing and advertising Officer) . Not Positive of a post in this but I’m looking for company that will
    grow our organization on the internet like how forums get targeted traffic in huge nubmers. I believe its amazing on how a lot of members and visitors
    these forums get. Any suggestions of firms that you’ve used could be great.

  36. I just did a little research on Drug Free America.
    I find it sad that they are publishing propaganda. Calvina Fay is a Professor has a masters degree. But I never saw the initials MD after her name.

Leave a Reply